Street Fighter 4: Who does it really appeal to?

[The Big Daddy C-Master]

Aug 16, 2014 18:00:20 GMT -5 JACK-2 said:

Aug 16, 2014 17:56:14 GMT -5 The Big Daddy C-Master said:

Yes, the long cinematic ultras are there to attract casuals but it takes too long. I like them nice and fast like this:



Go to 1:06.

Quick, but dramatic. Modern games should learn a thing or two.

Nothing says owned like a quick finish.

Even custom combos were neat and fast. Remember Shosho and Paint the Fence?

[JACK-2]

Bloated cinematics are killing games TBH.

[gurpwnder]

Yeah, CVS2 and Soul Calibur 2 are my favourite fighting games. So much for a player to work with.

[gurpwnder]

Oh man, sho-sho-sho and paint the fence were ridiculous.

[The Big Daddy C-Master]

What other games do you feel have too many cinematics Jack?

Aug 16, 2014 18:13:09 GMT -5 gurpwnder said:

Oh man, sho-sho-sho and paint the fence were ridiculous.

Yea that's why I made that video to show how insane they were and with the hitbox controller.

Capcom vs SNK 2 was great because of the sheer amount of options, instead of the new stuff which took away the options.

[gurpwnder]

Aug 16, 2014 18:09:33 GMT -5 JACK-2 said:

Bloated cinematics are killing games TBH.

SF4's pre-Ultra cinematics aren't TOO much longer than old fighting games, but they're not too neccessary. When they zoom in on the character, it's hard to tell what the other character is doing at the time. Also yeah, the actual Ultras themselves take a millenia. Stuff like E.Ryu's U2 and Oni's U1 take a REALLY long time.

[JACK-2]

Aug 16, 2014 18:18:13 GMT -5 The Big Daddy C-Master said:

What other games do you feel have too many cinematics Jack?

Not counting fighting games, ninja gaiden 2 added the flashy finishing moves for enemies and bosses. It was inspired by God of war another cinematic game.

[The Big Daddy C-Master]

NG went down the casual route as well, why can't games just stay good and do what they were already doing?

Aug 16, 2014 18:27:16 GMT -5 gurpwnder said:

Aug 16, 2014 18:09:33 GMT -5 JACK-2 said:

Bloated cinematics are killing games TBH.

SF4's pre-Ultra cinematics aren't TOO much longer than old fighting games, but they're not too neccessary. When they zoom in on the character, it's hard to tell what the other character is doing at the time. Also yeah, the actual Ultras themselves take a millenia. Stuff like E.Ryu's U2 and Oni's U1 take a REALLY long time.

I think that's what he means. The whole animation. Ibuki's U2 is probably the worst offender, it just goes on and on and on...

[JACK-2]

Because the gentrification of games. It's more and more expensive to make meaning they need more money and more people playing them. Remember the debate about used games and what Cliff Blizenski said?

www.themarysue.com/used-games/

People got up his ass about it, but he's right. Game development cost are too high, but gamers keep buying triple A games anyway. But, complain about how it effects the market. People are stupid.

[gurpwnder]

Aug 16, 2014 18:32:52 GMT -5 The Big Daddy C-Master said:

NG went down the casual route as well, why can't games just stay good and do what they were already doing?

Aug 16, 2014 18:27:16 GMT -5 gurpwnder said:

SF4's pre-Ultra cinematics aren't TOO much longer than old fighting games, but they're not too neccessary. When they zoom in on the character, it's hard to tell what the other character is doing at the time. Also yeah, the actual Ultras themselves take a millenia. Stuff like E.Ryu's U2 and Oni's U1 take a REALLY long time.

I think that's what he means. The whole animation. Ibuki's U2 is probably the worst offender, it just goes on and on and on...

Oh yeah. I have enough time to pause the game, type 'GG' or 'nice' to them on Xbox Live and be ready to play the next round

[The Big Daddy C-Master]

Aug 16, 2014 18:41:10 GMT -5 gurpwnder said:

Aug 16, 2014 18:32:52 GMT -5 The Big Daddy C-Master said:

NG went down the casual route as well, why can't games just stay good and do what they were already doing?

I think that's what he means. The whole animation. Ibuki's U2 is probably the worst offender, it just goes on and on and on...

Oh yeah. I have enough time to pause the game, type 'GG' or 'nice' to them on Xbox Live and be ready to play the next round

I could probably go and use the bathroom and come back before the next round, which reminds me. Why in the hell is there so much wait in between matches. Selecting characters, stages, the intros, and ultras. It probably takes up like 1/2 the time of the match. They need a rematch button. It's a shame they didn't do that in this game.

There are other things they can do in this game that make it more convenient as well.

[The Big Daddy C-Master]

Aug 16, 2014 18:39:35 GMT -5 JACK-2 said:

Because the gentrification of games. It's more and more expensive to make meaning they need more money and more people playing them. Remember the debate about used games and what Cliff Blizenski said?

www.themarysue.com/used-games/

People got up his ass about it, but he's right. Game development cost are too high, but gamers keep buying triple A games anyway. But, complain about how it effects the market. People are stupid.

Well that's because they blow so much money on special effects and nonsense. I'd say the economy plays a role as well, they have to get more out of every game. They use special effects to get to the masses and then jack it up even more.

People who buy all of their games at full cost are silly. I always wait until a console has been out for a while before I purchase it, and then I get the games used for cheaper. With PC you can buy games for pennies on the dollar and they do well there. Nowadays making games on consoles can be pricey because of all the middle men that get in the way as well.

A lot of their cost goes into advertisement and other stuff, better technology should make game development cheaper. I mean look at Kof spending tons of time and money on art while Capcom uses computer stuff because it is fast and cheap.

I remember some old games getting very expensive, especially hard to find games, but I remember other games being cheaper. Games now seem to sit right at the $60 mark.

[JACK-2]

Aug 16, 2014 18:54:42 GMT -5 The Big Daddy C-Master said:

Well that's because they blow so much money on special effects and nonsense. I'd say the economy plays a role as well, they have to get more out of every game. They use special effects to get to the masses and then jack it up even more.

People who buy all of their games at full cost are silly. I always wait until a console has been out for a while before I purchase it, and then I get the games used for cheaper. With PC you can buy games for pennies on the dollar and they do well there. Nowadays making games on consoles can be pricey because of all the middle men that get in the way as well.

A lot of their cost goes into advertisement and other stuff, better technology should make game development cheaper. I mean look at Kof spending tons of time and money on art while Capcom uses computer stuff because it is fast and cheap.

I remember some old games getting very expensive, especially hard to find games, but I remember other games being cheaper. Games now seem to sit right at the $60 mark.

It's a vicious cycle, games cost alot because of set pieces: Voice acting and lighting engines. They attract casuals which in turn makes them make more games focused on set pieces.


Video games look fairly nice after HD. I don't think we need more set pieces. Focus on gameplay first, look how long the Wii took to get on HD? It managed well, imo. Because they prioritized gameplay, even if it could be argued as gimmicky gameplay it's still gameplay.

[The Big Daddy C-Master]

Aug 16, 2014 18:59:53 GMT -5 JACK-2 said:

Aug 16, 2014 18:54:42 GMT -5 The Big Daddy C-Master said:

Well that's because they blow so much money on special effects and nonsense. I'd say the economy plays a role as well, they have to get more out of every game. They use special effects to get to the masses and then jack it up even more.

People who buy all of their games at full cost are silly. I always wait until a console has been out for a while before I purchase it, and then I get the games used for cheaper. With PC you can buy games for pennies on the dollar and they do well there. Nowadays making games on consoles can be pricey because of all the middle men that get in the way as well.

A lot of their cost goes into advertisement and other stuff, better technology should make game development cheaper. I mean look at Kof spending tons of time and money on art while Capcom uses computer stuff because it is fast and cheap.

I remember some old games getting very expensive, especially hard to find games, but I remember other games being cheaper. Games now seem to sit right at the $60 mark.

It's a vicious cycle, games cost alot because of set pieces: Voice acting and lighting engines. They attract casuals which in turn makes them make more games focused on set pieces.


Video games look fairly nice after HD. I don't think we need more set pieces. Focus on gameplay first, look how long the Wii took to get on HD? It managed well, imo. Because they prioritized gameplay, even if it could be argued as gimmicky gameplay it's still gameplay.

Honesty a huge part of gaming costs comes down to the labor cost of paying workers. I think I mentioned before a lot of these unions and the like try to make it difficult to use machines to substitute a lot of humans for things such as voice actors for instance. But of course, whatever sells is what developers are going to do. It wasn't necessary to spend much on old games when the only people playing them were children and nerds. Now everybody is on them. This is another reason that I think mobiles are going to take off because they are just so cheap to make games on.

[gurpwnder]

You guys wanna make another thread about the direction of modern video games? I think we're done ranting about SF4 here.

Also, didja guys know that Gamespot is considering actively 'working' with game developers to help decide which parts of a game should be cut out for pre-order content? Also, the fact that the entire cast of the Aliens movie is pre-order DLC for the next Aliens game? (source: Jimquisition) I'm not happy with the games industry and haven't been for quite some time.

[The Big Daddy C-Master]

Aug 16, 2014 19:22:46 GMT -5 gurpwnder said:

You guys wanna make another thread about the direction of modern video games? I think we're done ranting about SF4 here.

Also, didja guys know that Gamespot is considering actively 'working' with game developers to help decide which parts of a game should be cut out for pre-order content? Also, the fact that the entire cast of the Aliens movie is pre-order DLC for the next Aliens game? (source: Jimquisition) I'm not happy with the games industry and haven't been for quite some time.

Yea, let's keep the SF4 stuff in SF4. You can make a new thread if you wish. I figured we had an old one around here somewhere, but I can always move and merge them so you're welcome to do it.