Post by MGNoxa on Jan 17, 2016 19:38:12 GMT -5
(This post is all over the place and the quoted sections are not in any specific order, it was done this way so I could easily respond.)
The Big Daddy C-Master you're taking it too far. Why does real life stuff have to get involved? I'm officially done on this because you're talking about stuff that I agree with you on and pretending I don't or can't agree with you because I said that we have to physically be careful around women. Not once did I say it's okay for a woman to hit a man and a man not to hit, I've said time and time again there's a big difference between a woman giving me a playful slap or a woman trying to attack me, very big difference but you keep combining the two and it's really frustrating.
What does this even mean? There's no double standard here. I have no double standard with male and female violence, ZERO. ZERO, I'm telling you ZERO, it goes deeper than it's more comfortable to watch men get hit for comedy much deeper than that. It's not a double standard, it's a fact not an opinion. There's zero double standards here. In order for you to claim that I have a double standard on this I would have to say "Men can get beaten up for the sake of comedy but women can't" I've never said that, I said when Ruru first got hit it was funny, the second time it was still funny but then it happened again and again and it stopped being funny. That's not a double standard. You keep bringing me up on an explanation I gave on why people are comfortable or uncomfortable with it. It's an explanation!
You keep claiming I have these odd views based on nothing. It's really frustrating. There's a difference between liking something and trying to show that there's nothing wrong with it and sticking up for artists freedom and then saying giving the explanation for why audiences feel more comfortable with male slapstick versus female slapstick. In order for this to be a true double standard I would have to say "Female sexualisation is ok, but female violence isn't" (technically not a double standard but i'll go with it just for you) I haven't said this. Not once.
What does this have to do with anything I've said? This is why I'm stopping. This has nothing to do with what I've discussed. This is like the stupid argument anti-gay people have "Gay marriage can't be allowed because fathers will marry their sons or people will marry their dogs." It's like WTF does this have to do with gay marriage? You're just using straw man arguments to make yourself look right, defeating arguments that I never presented.
When you look at action movies men and women prefer to watch someone like Sylvester Stallone run around, when a woman does it the movie makes no money. It's the same principal as in comedy because the audiences are more comfortable with it. It goes deeper than that but that's why it's like that because they want money and audiences will pay money to watch Sylvester Stallone. I want more female action stars surely if I had double standards on female violence I would be against it right?
You're repeating yourself and bringing up arguments that I have already put down and again bringing up arguments that have nothing to do with what we are supposed to be discussion.
I never said women can't be used as comedy props, I said why audiences feel uncomfortable with it. You're confusing my opinions with the opinions of the many. I have no problem when Haruhiko hits Ruru, he does it too many times in increasingly violent ways and it stops being funny, all i did is question it, was the joke overused? Were they just trying to show Haruhiko is a dick? Is this something that will be addressed later on? That's all I did, I never said it can't happen or that it shouldn't happen.
So a woman who doesn't want to give a man a blowjob gets kicked out of the house? Okay nothing wrong with that but to kick her out in order to get the blowjob... That I have a problem with. It's taking advantage of a woman who now thinks she needs to do this in order to be happy with him, it's gross and rapey. If it ended at her getting booted out there's nothing wrong with that it's the ulterior motives and what comes after that makes it gross.
But you did it again, "You're complaining about women being victims here? How many women take advantage of a man's lack of experience and confidence..." What does this have to do with that story? What does it have to do with it? This straw man stuff is really frustrating me.
We've had this discussion before and you know my opinions why would you bring it up again when you know we agree? We've had this discussion "fail to realise it's because if anything else is done, people will cry sexism." I've said this before. Why are you bringing this up?
I don't understand what this has to do with female violence in comedy. Audiences find it funnier when men are hurt. Men can't joke about that and it sucks, but like a lot of jokes you need to do it in the right crowd. You know my opinions, you know I wouldn't care if Haruhiko was a chick and she got thrown out of a window.
Yes I have said this but again I was speaking for the majority of the audience. You seem to be arguing with opinions that aren't mine, all I can do is repeat myself because I don't belong in the majority audience for this.
I want creators to be able to do what they want without feeling scared of backlash. You know I want this and you're arguing with me over something stupid and it's even more stupid because you're arguing with me over assumptions you've made up about my opinions ignoring past discussions and brining straw man arguments in... I can't help it when the audience prefers male slapstick and I have a pretty good reason as to why they prefer it. That's not me agreeing.
We agree on almost everything yet every time we have a discussion on similar topics it always ends up in long and drawn out arguments that are based on an incredibly small disagreement. This was supposed to be a discussion on the role of female physical comedy using Haruhiko and Ruru's relationship. Instead it's turned into this weird discussion where 90% of what's discussed isn't relevant and you've conveniently forgotten my opinions on other topics so you can bring them in again for no real reason other than to present a straw man argument.
You know I don't care about female characters getting beaten up in fighting games, you know I don't care about what a female character does... You know I don't care about this crap because all I want is better stuff yet you bring it up as a defence and I'm just confused.
When you said I had double standards with the women of MKX and other female characters, I could see where you were coming from I don't agree with you but I could understand why you would think that way. The double standards you are presenting here aren't double standards and my like of sexualised female characters is a totally different topic than female comedy yet it's only relevant to you because you want to present me as a hypocrite so you can gain the upper hand in the argument. Even if I said "Women can't be hurt for comedy." (I haven't said this, this is the audiences opinion not mine) but I still defended the sexy costumes women wear, that's not a double standard because it's a different topic.
You said it yourself a double standard is calling R. Mika's outfit too sexy but not Chun Li's. That's a brilliant example of a double standard. However if I said R. Mika's outfit is too sexy but Ivy's (SoulCalibur) isn't too sexy, well that's not a double standard because they are in different games which means they need to be looked at differently. (I don't think R. Mika's outfit is too sexy!)
So I'm done, I shouldn't say I'm done because you're going to respond with something that makes me want to respond but I really want to be done because this isn't the discussion we were supposed to be having and it's just gone into a really awkward place talking about stuff that I don't want to talk about, has no relevance to the topic and weird assumptions and accusations.
The Big Daddy C-Master you're taking it too far. Why does real life stuff have to get involved? I'm officially done on this because you're talking about stuff that I agree with you on and pretending I don't or can't agree with you because I said that we have to physically be careful around women. Not once did I say it's okay for a woman to hit a man and a man not to hit, I've said time and time again there's a big difference between a woman giving me a playful slap or a woman trying to attack me, very big difference but you keep combining the two and it's really frustrating.
1. Women are used for visual sex appeal differently than men are and many women are eye candy. Women and men have an easier time looking at this than men portrayed the same way. SJW's complain about this and this is somehow you have a problem with it. Is it because you like looking at scantily clad women? When they tell you "Go get laid." Does that make their position ok? How is their complaining any more stupid than the double standard you believe in? You believe in a double standard when it comes to male and female violence and they want to cover up women and not men. How is the logic any different?
What does this even mean? There's no double standard here. I have no double standard with male and female violence, ZERO. ZERO, I'm telling you ZERO, it goes deeper than it's more comfortable to watch men get hit for comedy much deeper than that. It's not a double standard, it's a fact not an opinion. There's zero double standards here. In order for you to claim that I have a double standard on this I would have to say "Men can get beaten up for the sake of comedy but women can't" I've never said that, I said when Ruru first got hit it was funny, the second time it was still funny but then it happened again and again and it stopped being funny. That's not a double standard. You keep bringing me up on an explanation I gave on why people are comfortable or uncomfortable with it. It's an explanation!
You keep claiming I have these odd views based on nothing. It's really frustrating. There's a difference between liking something and trying to show that there's nothing wrong with it and sticking up for artists freedom and then saying giving the explanation for why audiences feel more comfortable with male slapstick versus female slapstick. In order for this to be a true double standard I would have to say "Female sexualisation is ok, but female violence isn't" (technically not a double standard but i'll go with it just for you) I haven't said this. Not once.
2. People believed that slavery was ok in the past, or that women should have fewer rights. Men in the past were able to hit their wives. Does that make it ok because that's the way people view it?
3. People don't have a problem with teachers sleeping with underage boys so does that make that ok too because many more complain if a man does it?
4. Should a person who is poor be allowed to steal from someone who is rich? People feel that the rich stealing from the poor is far worse, but does it make it ok the other way around?
This is the kind of logic you're using and that's why I have a problem with it.
3. People don't have a problem with teachers sleeping with underage boys so does that make that ok too because many more complain if a man does it?
4. Should a person who is poor be allowed to steal from someone who is rich? People feel that the rich stealing from the poor is far worse, but does it make it ok the other way around?
This is the kind of logic you're using and that's why I have a problem with it.
When you look at action movies men and women prefer to watch someone like Sylvester Stallone run around, when a woman does it the movie makes no money. It's the same principal as in comedy because the audiences are more comfortable with it. It goes deeper than that but that's why it's like that because they want money and audiences will pay money to watch Sylvester Stallone. I want more female action stars surely if I had double standards on female violence I would be against it right?
Many people don't care at all. By the way people have a problem with women being hurt, so should we remove women from fighting games or other games where females are the lead? Would you cosign with that?
You're repeating yourself and bringing up arguments that I have already put down and again bringing up arguments that have nothing to do with what we are supposed to be discussion.
Of course not. Since it's ok with you in that scenario because you like it when women are seen as "strong" but not when they're used as comedy props. Why are men so pussified they need to just be dominated by women in these forms of entertainment. It wasn't that way before.
I never said women can't be used as comedy props, I said why audiences feel uncomfortable with it. You're confusing my opinions with the opinions of the many. I have no problem when Haruhiko hits Ruru, he does it too many times in increasingly violent ways and it stops being funny, all i did is question it, was the joke overused? Were they just trying to show Haruhiko is a dick? Is this something that will be addressed later on? That's all I did, I never said it can't happen or that it shouldn't happen.
Nothing about that story had ANYTHING to do with rape, you're just trying to portray it as worse because he didn't want to have her there if she wouldn't put out. Women take advantage of men all of the time to get free things, alimony and child support settlements, and everything in between. You're complaining about women being victims here? How many women take advantage of a man's lack of experience and confidence and commit things like paternity fraud? Somehow you have a problem with a guy kicking a woman out of his place when she came alone.
This is an example of white knighting. You're always concerned about the condition of a woman, even at the expense of a man. This is some westernized leftist stuff you've been indoctrinated with.
This is an example of white knighting. You're always concerned about the condition of a woman, even at the expense of a man. This is some westernized leftist stuff you've been indoctrinated with.
So a woman who doesn't want to give a man a blowjob gets kicked out of the house? Okay nothing wrong with that but to kick her out in order to get the blowjob... That I have a problem with. It's taking advantage of a woman who now thinks she needs to do this in order to be happy with him, it's gross and rapey. If it ended at her getting booted out there's nothing wrong with that it's the ulterior motives and what comes after that makes it gross.
But you did it again, "You're complaining about women being victims here? How many women take advantage of a man's lack of experience and confidence..." What does this have to do with that story? What does it have to do with it? This straw man stuff is really frustrating me.
You're joking right? So all of the shows where men are portrayed as stupid or inferior to women is just in my imagination? This crap has infested entertainment more than the "less sexy costumes" stuff you're always complaining about. It's universal, even in Japanese culture. You complain that women are portrayed as "perfect" but fail to realize it's because if anything else is done, people will cry sexism. That's sexist in and of itself.
We've had this discussion before and you know my opinions why would you bring it up again when you know we agree? We've had this discussion "fail to realise it's because if anything else is done, people will cry sexism." I've said this before. Why are you bringing this up?
Wait. Female on male violence is much more common even when the women are stronger than the men. This invalidates all of your points and you find this acceptable.
Did the joke of him being knocked out of the room over and over again overstay its welcome?
A man can joke about a woman being hit and even THAT is offensive even if nothing is shown. It's just sexist.
Did the joke of him being knocked out of the room over and over again overstay its welcome?
A man can joke about a woman being hit and even THAT is offensive even if nothing is shown. It's just sexist.
I don't understand what this has to do with female violence in comedy. Audiences find it funnier when men are hurt. Men can't joke about that and it sucks, but like a lot of jokes you need to do it in the right crowd. You know my opinions, you know I wouldn't care if Haruhiko was a chick and she got thrown out of a window.
No, it has nothing to do with it because even stuff with children has the males portrayed as different. You said it before, women are used less because "It's offensive". It's nothing but PC garbage. Nobody is hurt, it's fiction, and it's all comedy all the same. People think a man being hurt is ok because they see a man as expendable and not a woman.
Yes I have said this but again I was speaking for the majority of the audience. You seem to be arguing with opinions that aren't mine, all I can do is repeat myself because I don't belong in the majority audience for this.
I want creators to be able to do what they want without feeling scared of backlash. You know I want this and you're arguing with me over something stupid and it's even more stupid because you're arguing with me over assumptions you've made up about my opinions ignoring past discussions and brining straw man arguments in... I can't help it when the audience prefers male slapstick and I have a pretty good reason as to why they prefer it. That's not me agreeing.
We agree on almost everything yet every time we have a discussion on similar topics it always ends up in long and drawn out arguments that are based on an incredibly small disagreement. This was supposed to be a discussion on the role of female physical comedy using Haruhiko and Ruru's relationship. Instead it's turned into this weird discussion where 90% of what's discussed isn't relevant and you've conveniently forgotten my opinions on other topics so you can bring them in again for no real reason other than to present a straw man argument.
You know I don't care about female characters getting beaten up in fighting games, you know I don't care about what a female character does... You know I don't care about this crap because all I want is better stuff yet you bring it up as a defence and I'm just confused.
When you said I had double standards with the women of MKX and other female characters, I could see where you were coming from I don't agree with you but I could understand why you would think that way. The double standards you are presenting here aren't double standards and my like of sexualised female characters is a totally different topic than female comedy yet it's only relevant to you because you want to present me as a hypocrite so you can gain the upper hand in the argument. Even if I said "Women can't be hurt for comedy." (I haven't said this, this is the audiences opinion not mine) but I still defended the sexy costumes women wear, that's not a double standard because it's a different topic.
You said it yourself a double standard is calling R. Mika's outfit too sexy but not Chun Li's. That's a brilliant example of a double standard. However if I said R. Mika's outfit is too sexy but Ivy's (SoulCalibur) isn't too sexy, well that's not a double standard because they are in different games which means they need to be looked at differently. (I don't think R. Mika's outfit is too sexy!)
So I'm done, I shouldn't say I'm done because you're going to respond with something that makes me want to respond but I really want to be done because this isn't the discussion we were supposed to be having and it's just gone into a really awkward place talking about stuff that I don't want to talk about, has no relevance to the topic and weird assumptions and accusations.
