Does God exist?

[The Big Daddy C-Master]

psyquis52 said:

darthrevan said:

I personally think sin is so easy because Satan is constantly trying to get us to do it. He is making sin look appealing, so that is why people do it. If you think about it, good deads are not always fun to do. People try to do stuff the easy way, which is sinning, because it easier.

Nothing new there, but let's not underestimate our own capacity for sin.

After all Satan can't be everywhere.

Yes we are not pure, and in fact we don't deserve God's grace, no matter how good we are.

[Psyquis52]

admin said:

psyquis52 said:

Nothing new there, but let's not underestimate our own capacity for sin.

After all Satan can't be everywhere.

Yes we are not pure, and in fact we don't deserve God's grace, no matter how good we are.

And that's it in a nutshell.

This is exactly why we need Jesus. I'm not used to people on the internet understanding these principles. I always feel like I'm throwing pearls before swine so I don't usually even attempt.

[The Big Daddy C-Master]

psyquis52 said:

admin said:

Yes we are not pure, and in fact we don't deserve God's grace, no matter how good we are.

And that's it in a nutshell.

This is exactly why we need Jesus. I'm not used to people on the internet understanding these principles. I always feel like I'm throwing pearls before swine so I don't usually even attempt.

Well there are some people that understand, or try to anyways...

[Psyquis52]

Well I don't understand but I still seek understanding.

Nice to see I'm not the only one.

[The Big Daddy C-Master]

psyquis52 said:

Well I don't understand but I still seek understanding.

Nice to see I'm not the only one.

It's also about living a certain way, instead of simply telling people how to live. Which honestly to me is a relief because I don't really want to force people how to live.

[Psyquis52]

Bah.

No point in living a certain way. I say, "Do as I say not as I do."
That's my motto.
































Just kidding.

[The Big Daddy C-Master]

psyquis52 said:

Bah.

No point in living a certain way. I say, "Do as I say not as I do."
That's my motto.
































Just kidding.

No you are definitely much bettter than some people I have come across. I'm going to get more into this pretty soon.... Just getting things like they were once again.

[Psyquis52]

I have no idea what that means.

[kuwabara]

well the existence's of god in the mind has been proven. How ever that does not mean that the existence's of god has fully been proven.

[darthrevan]

Nobody can prove God's existence. Thats why Christianity is based on faith.

[tshern]

Here I go with the translation problems... Anyways, doesn't it say many times in the Bible that you will be forgiven if you have faith? If my memory serves me correctly, it says something about faith size of a mustard grain and being forgiven because of that. Thus, the people who believe in God but commit sins go to Heaven.

If any of you have something to ask from a diehard atheist, go ahead. I love these discussions.

[darthrevan]

tshern said:

Here I go with the translation problems... Anyways, doesn't it say many times in the Bible that you will be forgiven if you have faith? If my memory serves me correctly, it says something about faith size of a mustard grain and being forgiven because of that. Thus, the people who believe in God but commit sins go to Heaven.

If any of you have something to ask from a diehard atheist, go ahead. I love these discussions.

Okay. According to you Satanists will go to heaven because they believe in God even though they worship the devil.

If 99% of the Bible tells us how we should live our lives, I think it would be required to live that way.

[The Big Daddy C-Master]

darthrevan said:

tshern said:

Here I go with the translation problems... Anyways, doesn't it say many times in the Bible that you will be forgiven if you have faith? If my memory serves me correctly, it says something about faith size of a mustard grain and being forgiven because of that. Thus, the people who believe in God but commit sins go to Heaven.

If any of you have something to ask from a diehard atheist, go ahead. I love these discussions.

Okay. According to you Satanists will go to heaven because they believe in God even though they worship the devil.

If 99% of the Bible tells us how we should live our lives, I think it would be required to live that way.

Then there's the safe side, if I'm wrong, I was still on good behaviour so if nothing happens, I would take that chance with a good record than relying on it with a bad one if you know what I mean...

[Psyquis52]

Wisdom in a nutshell from C master.

[The Big Daddy C-Master]

psyquis52 said:

Wisdom in a nutshell from C master.

;D

[Syrenna]

Although I am an atheist, I had to go with 'Don't know', because I don't. I don't believe there's a God, or some Almighty being, but I don't know for certain so it would have been unfair to vote 'No'. I also think that goes for those who have voted 'Yes'. How can you possibly know for sure? That speaks volumes to me, of humans believing themselves to be better and more knowledgeable than they actually are. None of us know if there's really a God. Be fair.

darthrevan said:

Okay. According to you Satanists will go to heaven because they believe in God even though they worship the devil.

If 99% of the Bible tells us how we should live our lives, I think it would be required to live that way.

Satanists do not 'worship the devil'. Common misconception.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanism

Try reading between the lines. It's not the worship of a representation of Satan the devil.

[The Big Daddy C-Master]

syrenna said:

Although I am an atheist, I had to go with 'Don't know', because I don't. I don't believe there's a God, or some Almighty being, but I don't know for certain so it would have been unfair to vote 'No'. I also think that goes for those who have voted 'Yes'. How can you possibly know for sure? That speaks volumes to me, of humans believing themselves to be better and more knowledgeable than they actually are. None of us know if there's really a God. Be fair.

darthrevan said:

Okay. According to you Satanists will go to heaven because they believe in God even though they worship the devil.

If 99% of the Bible tells us how we should live our lives, I think it would be required to live that way.

Satanists do not 'worship the devil'. Common misconception.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanism

Try reading between the lines. It's not the worship of a representation of Satan the devil.

I agree that we can't 100% prove that he exists beyond the shadow of a doubt, but it's the essence of faith that makes it what it is... to believe without proof.

[Syrenna]

No, that's just silly. Blind faith, you say? Not a chance, I need something real.

[alfheim]

syrenna said:

Although I am an atheist, I had to go with 'Don't know', because I don't. I don't believe there's a God, or some Almighty being, but I don't know for certain so it would have been unfair to vote 'No'. I also think that goes for those who have voted 'Yes'. How can you possibly know for sure? That speaks volumes to me, of humans believing themselves to be better and more knowledgeable than they actually are. None of us know if there's really a God. Be fair.

Yes but as I mentioned before the whole problem with proof of God is that by defintion he cannot be fully understood because he is infinite. If he cannot be fully understood how can you prove for 100 percent that he exists?

You can prove that some force creating the universe but you cannot fully understand or define exactly what that thing is.

Heres some food for though. I was watching a program about people who were considered to be dead ie they were in a state were their heart was not beating and there was no brain activity. The person who believed in an afterlife saw visions, the person who did not belive in anything saw nothing.

Have I said this before lol.

Also bare in mind there are different ways of thinking. Logic is important but it has limits, it seems there is a highier form of logic which religons try to teach through practices like meditation.

[The Big Daddy C-Master]

alfheim said:

syrenna said:

Although I am an atheist, I had to go with 'Don't know', because I don't. I don't believe there's a God, or some Almighty being, but I don't know for certain so it would have been unfair to vote 'No'. I also think that goes for those who have voted 'Yes'. How can you possibly know for sure? That speaks volumes to me, of humans believing themselves to be better and more knowledgeable than they actually are. None of us know if there's really a God. Be fair.

Yes but as I mentioned before the whole problem with proof of God is that by defintion he cannot be fully understood because he is infinite. If he cannot be fully understood how can you prove for 100 percent that he exists?

You can prove that some force creating the universe but you cannot fully understand or define exactly what that thing is.

Heres some food for though. I was watching a program about people who were considered to be dead ie they were in a state were their heart was not beating and there was no brain activity. The person who believed in an afterlife saw visions, the person who did not belive in anything saw nothing.

Have I said this before lol.

Also bare in mind there are different ways of thinking. Logic is important but it has limits, it seems there is a highier form of logic which religons try to teach through practices like meditation.

Good point, we can never 100% understand what god is anyways, so no need to attempt and perfectly define him, because we'll never succeed here on Earth.

[The Big Daddy C-Master]

syrenna said:

No, that's just silly. Blind faith, you say? Not a chance, I need something real.

No, you shouldn't commit to anything blindly, but you should research and also know that you need faith to make that commitment. You have faith in things you can't prove all the time, every single day you rely on things to happen that you can not prove reliable each and every time. There's tons of things to read, and arguments on each side, but if you lack the faith you won't see it no matter how much is presented to you.

You get up and you have faith that the bus will arrive on time, even though it hasn't arrived yet. You have faith that the people on the road will follow the same rules as you do, even though you haven't set foot. You have faith in these things even though you haven't seen the result.

[Magic attack]

syrenna said:

darthrevan said:

Okay. According to you Satanists will go to heaven because they believe in God even though they worship the devil.

If 99% of the Bible tells us how we should live our lives, I think it would be required to live that way.

Satanists do not 'worship the devil'. Common misconception.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanism

Try reading between the lines. It's not the worship of a representation of Satan the devil.

2 things on this...


1. I think this was more of what he was referring to-

Theistic Satanism

Although he should have used the term 'Diabolatry' or Devil Worship or Theistic Satanism.


Although...

2. The Oxford English Dictionary offers three definitions of the word “Satanism”:

1. A Satanic or diabolical disposition, doctrine, spirit, or contrivance. 2. The characteristics of the ‘Satanic school.’ 3. The worship of Satan, alleged to have been practised in France in the latter part of the 19th century; the principles and rites of the Satanists.

This first definition originated from An Apologie of the Church of England written by Thomas Harding (1565). During the 16th century, the word Satanism referred to both Protestants and Catholics, depending on which Christian group was using the term. The second definition refers to any writings or teachings of authors and poets such as Lord Byron. And, the third definition refers to the actual worship of Satan as a god. For a more detailed look at these three definitions, and a discussion of 19th-century “Satanism,” see Gareth J. Medway, Lure of the Sinister: The Unnatural History of Satanism (2001).


Oxford says he was correct, if referring to the 19th Century "Satanism" that was practised in France.

Just some food for thought.

[The Big Daddy C-Master]

Well that is true, but I think Satanists of today hate to be immediately associated with that, but it isn't wrong in using a correct term either.

[Magic attack]

admin said:

syrenna said:

No, that's just silly. Blind faith, you say? Not a chance, I need something real.

No, you shouldn't commit to anything blindly, but you should research and also know that you need faith to make that commitment. You have faith in things you can't prove all the time, every single day you rely on things to happen that you can not prove reliable each and every time. There's tons of things to read, and arguments on each side, but if you lack the faith you won't see it no matter how much is presented to you.

You get up and you have faith that the bus will arrive on time, even though it hasn't arrived yet. You have faith that the people on the road will follow the same rules as you do, even though you haven't set foot. You have faith in these things even though you haven't seen the result.

I agree with this summary, it is only blind faith to someone that doesn't believe.

While not a religious man at all, I do understand how and why some people believe in God. I respect their decision, even though it isnt the correct one for me.

[The Big Daddy C-Master]

shakezula said:

admin said:

No, you shouldn't commit to anything blindly, but you should research and also know that you need faith to make that commitment. You have faith in things you can't prove all the time, every single day you rely on things to happen that you can not prove reliable each and every time. There's tons of things to read, and arguments on each side, but if you lack the faith you won't see it no matter how much is presented to you.

You get up and you have faith that the bus will arrive on time, even though it hasn't arrived yet. You have faith that the people on the road will follow the same rules as you do, even though you haven't set foot. You have faith in these things even though you haven't seen the result.

I agree with this summary, it is only blind faith to someone that doesn't believe.

While not a religious man at all, I do understand how and why some people believe in God. I respect their decision, even though it isnt the correct one for me.

And even I see that people don't follow God, and while I can understand the reasons, I am reluctant whether to say they alone are just "the reasons".

[Magic attack]

admin said:

shakezula said:

I agree with this summary, it is only blind faith to someone that doesn't believe.

While not a religious man at all, I do understand how and why some people believe in God. I respect their decision, even though it isnt the correct one for me.

And even I see that people don't follow God, and while I can understand the reasons, I am reluctant whether to say they alone are just "the reasons".

To me its more about living a righteous life, and using common sense.

[The Big Daddy C-Master]

shakezula said:

admin said:

And even I see that people don't follow God, and while I can understand the reasons, I am reluctant whether to say they alone are just "the reasons".

To me its more about living a righteous life, and using common sense.

I focus my main goal on treating others like I want to be treated. Even I disagree with Christians at times, especially when they are hypocritical.

[Magic attack]

admin said:

shakezula said:

To me its more about living a righteous life, and using common sense.

I focus my main goal on treating others like I want to be treated. Even I disagree with Christians at times, especially when they are hypocritical.

I can understand that. I hate everyone equally, so that is how I expect to be treated.

[Dja Majista]

Yes but as I mentioned before the whole problem with proof of God is that by defintion he cannot be fully understood because he is infinite. If he cannot be fully understood how can you prove for 100 percent that he exists?

I agree that you can't prove him 100%, just disagree on the reasoning. You don't have to fully understand something to be certain that it exists. People knew lightning existed forever but they thought it was fire at first and they also though bolts came from the sky to the ground.
Anyway I think the problem with trying to prove God's existance is we have never really witnessed a world where he definitely does not exist. Imagine living in say 1750, where people didn't know what oxygen was. Then all of a sudden all the oxygen is gone and people start suffocating. Well, now they at least know that there was something in the air that kept them alive not the air itself.

You can prove that some force creating the universe but you cannot fully understand or define exactly what that thing is.

I don't think it's possible to prove 100% the universe was created by some force, necessarily. There is the possibility, that things were just always there, though it is unlikely (the design of the universe seems too intricate to be randomized). But I think our goal as humans is to do our best to find the most probable answer and go with it. The thing about being a human is that we can't prove everything 100%, so we have to have an element of faith.

[The Big Daddy C-Master]

shakezula said:

admin said:

I focus my main goal on treating others like I want to be treated. Even I disagree with Christians at times, especially when they are hypocritical.

I can understand that. I hate everyone equally, so that is how I expect to be treated.

Bah, you're a big softie.